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What exactly does "supports Linux" mean?

DISCUSSION Stephan von Krawczynski 6 participants 6 messages May 13, 2003

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#0 lore raw

Dear all,

I recently came across a very annoying question regarding Linux compatibility. It rises a fundamental question which should be discussed, IMHO. Facts are:
I bought a card from some vendor, claiming "support for Linux". I tried to make it work in a configuration with a standard 2.4.20 kernel from kernel.org. The drivers (kernel modules) are binary-only. They did not load because of a version mismatch. Asking for versions loadable with standard kernels, I got the response that they only support kernels from Red Hat and SuSE, but no standard kernels.
This leads to my simple question: how can one claim his product supports linux, if it does not work with a kernel.org kernel? Is there any paper or open statement from big L (hello btw ;-) available what you have to do to call yourself "supporting linux"?
I know that the technical background is ridiculous, because it should very well be possible to recompile their drivers under stock 2.4.20, but it looks like they don't want to, simply.
I am in fact a bit worried about this behaviour, because I take it as a first step to a general market split up already known to *nix.
My general conclusion would be that something not working with a standard kernel cannot be called "supporting linux", no matter what distros ever are supported. You may call me purist...
Any ideas?

Regards,
Stephan

#1 lore raw
Quoted 4 lines

This leads to my simple question: how can one claim his product supports linux, if it does not work with a kernel.org kernel? Is there any paper or open statement from big L (hello btw ;-) available what you have to do to call yourself "supporting linux"?

What about the following: a vendor provides linux drivers for one of its products (thanks!). These drivers simply do not work with some of its other products (all variants of the same basic product). There are no linux drivers for these other products. All the products claim to be supported under linux. This "linux support" is explicitly stated on each product's web-page whether it is really supported or not.

Duncan.

#2 lore raw
In reply to Stephan von Krawczynski
Quoted 6 lines · Stephan von Krawczynski

I bought a card from some vendor, claiming "support for Linux". I tried to make it work in a configuration with a standard 2.4.20 kernel from kernel.org. The drivers (kernel modules) are binary-only. They did not load because of a version mismatch. Asking for versions loadable with standard kernels, I got the response that they only support kernels from Red Hat and SuSE, but no standard kernels.

So send it back and consult local trading standards rules.

Quoted 4 lines

My general conclusion would be that something not working with a standard kernel cannot be called "supporting linux", no matter what distros ever are supported. You may call me purist...
Any ideas?

Linus owns the trademark for the USA certainly.

#3 lore raw
Quoted 12 lines · Alan Cox
Quoted 1 line · Stephan von Krawczynski

I bought a card from some vendor, claiming "support for Linux". I tried

to make

Quoted 1 line

it work in a configuration with a standard 2.4.20 kernel from kernel.org.

The

Quoted 2 lines

drivers (kernel modules) are binary-only. They did not load because of a version mismatch. Asking for versions loadable with standard kernels,

I got the

Quoted 1 line

response that they only support kernels from Red Hat and SuSE, but

no standard

Quoted 1 line

kernels.

If you really want it to work, try insmod -f modulename.o. See of it works. RedHat supplies kernels with "intermediate" version numbers like linux-2.4.18-24. A perfectly-good module from linux-2.4.18 may fail to load without the '-f' option, even though it is probably compatible. Try it, it may work fine. You can modify /etc/rc.d/rc.local to insert the module during startup so you don't have to muck with /etc/modules.conf (and having other startup-code change it when it "finds" new hardware.

Cheers,
Dick Johnson
Penguin : Linux version 2.4.20 on an i686 machine (797.90 BogoMips). Why is the government concerned about the lunatic fringe? Think about it.

#4 lore raw
Quoted 2 lines · Richard B. Johnson

If you really want it to work, try insmod -f modulename.o.[...]

Of course, don't do this unless you can live with the following :

1/ nobody will support you in this configuration.
2/ you have zero guarantee that your hardware will be supported in the future (what will happen when you upgrade to a new kernel with different interfaces and the vendor marketing folks decide that Linux support isn't a good thing anymore ?).

#5 lore raw
In reply to Alan Cox
Quoted 1 line · Alan Cox

On Maw, 2003-05-13 at 14:16, Stephan von Krawczynski wrote:

[snip]

Quoted 7 lines
Quoted 5 lines

My general conclusion would be that something not working with a standard kernel cannot be called "supporting linux", no matter what distros ever are supported. You may call me purist...
Any ideas?

Linus owns the trademark for the USA certainly.

Any ideas who (if anyone) owns it in the UK? Is there anywhere to go to find this out, perhaps for other countries too?

jc