Potential IIO meeting / future directions discussion at ELCE 2018 - Edinburgh 22-24 Oct
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.
I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
Chances are we won't actually 'finish' any non trivial discussions, but it is a lot easier to make progress on topics that you've at least outlined in person.
Please forward to anyone who may be interested and might not see it on the list before Sunday. Obviously Sunday isn't a cut off for discussion, it's just when I have hope to be able to draw together a proposal!
Jonathan
p.s. I'm planning to put a normal talk session proposal in as well. It'll trawl through a bit of the history of IIO (it's 10 years old this year!), lessons learned etc. Not a tutorial, but an analysis of some more general useful stuff with just enough description of IIO to let the uninitiated know what we are talking about! I'll also touch on encouraging new contributors etc. No idea if the committee will like that approach, so who knows ;)
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
- Lars
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.
Quoted 27 lines · On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 10:48:01 +0300 Daniel Baluta <[email protected]>…
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
Quoted 7 lines
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.
Cool - so it sounds like there is enough interest (given the very short notice!) to apply for a BoF. The tricky bit is I need to put together an abstract by later today.
So off the top of my head topics that come to mind are:
1. Userspace ABI pain points - the recent extensive discussions around the energy meters have certainly shown there are some nasty corners. The currently open question about floating point support is also interesting (though we may well have come to a conclusion about that long before October).
2. High performance usecases - (Lars leading this one if he is willing) DMA buffers and moving that infrastructure forward. There is a lot of out of kernel code around this currently, it would be nice to drag it in once we are sure on how it should work long term!
3. Missing in kernel consumer infrastructure. We never implemented consumer interfaces for events. I assume this may be because no one cares, but it does sometimes feel like we are working around that in some of the use cases rather than just fixing it.
4. The Front end / back end split. This is most interesting for SoC ADCs where we currently put out an IIO interface to userspace that no one cares about (sometimes). The plan was always to make that optional. Would be interesting to explore pushing this forward. This includes things like the little used available callbacks.
5. General performance questions - can we narrow the gap with the dodgy userspace hacks?
N. General process discussion - Is the current maintainer / review process
quick enough that it isn't causing anyone too much pain? What can we do better? I'm always happy to get some feedback on this btw.
So if at all possible, what I'm looking for is additional (of better) ideas to put down as somewhat of a placeholder to show we have lots to talk about.
If not I'll throw the above in with some editing.
Jonathan
Quoted 42 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Quoted 27 lines · On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 10:48:01 +0300 Daniel Baluta <[email protected]>…
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
Quoted 7 lines
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.Cool - so it sounds like there is enough interest (given the very short notice!) to apply for a BoF. The tricky bit is I need to put together an abstract by later today.
Quoted 6 lines
So off the top of my head topics that come to mind are:
1. Userspace ABI pain points - the recent extensive discussions around the energy meters have certainly shown there are some nasty corners. The currently open question about floating point support is also interesting (though we may well have come to a conclusion about that long before October).
Some things about ABI
1.a. Is cross device ABI achievable or are we moving towards IIO being a simple userspace and kernelspace bridge with each driver having its own ABI? Is IIO the new drivers/misc?
1.c. Beyond demos and toys. Is IIO suitable for real-world applications?
Quoted 31 lines
2. High performance usecases - (Lars leading this one if he is willing) DMA buffers and moving that infrastructure forward. There is a lot of out of kernel code around this currently, it would be nice to drag it in once we are sure on how it should work long term!
3. Missing in kernel consumer infrastructure. We never implemented consumer interfaces for events. I assume this may be because no one cares, but it does sometimes feel like we are working around that in some of the use cases rather than just fixing it.
4. The Front end / back end split. This is most interesting for SoC ADCs where we currently put out an IIO interface to userspace that no one cares about (sometimes). The plan was always to make that optional. Would be interesting to explore pushing this forward. This includes things like the little used available callbacks.
5. General performance questions - can we narrow the gap with the dodgy userspace hacks?
N. General process discussion - Is the current maintainer / review process
quick enough that it isn't causing anyone too much pain? What can we do better? I'm always happy to get some feedback on this btw.So if at all possible, what I'm looking for is additional (of better) ideas to put down as somewhat of a placeholder to show we have lots to talk about.
If not I'll throw the above in with some editing.
Jonathan
Quoted 50 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:16:35 +0200 Lars-Peter Clausen <[email protected]> wrote:
Quoted 42 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Quoted 27 lines · On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 10:48:01 +0300 Daniel Baluta <[email protected]>…
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
Quoted 7 lines
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.Cool - so it sounds like there is enough interest (given the very short notice!) to apply for a BoF. The tricky bit is I need to put together an abstract by later today.
Quoted 6 lines
So off the top of my head topics that come to mind are:
1. Userspace ABI pain points - the recent extensive discussions around the energy meters have certainly shown there are some nasty corners. The currently open question about floating point support is also interesting (though we may well have come to a conclusion about that long before October).
Quoted 5 lines
Some things about ABI
1.a. Is cross device ABI achievable or are we moving towards IIO being a simple userspace and kernelspace bridge with each driver having its own ABI? Is IIO the new
drivers/misc?
Good points. I'll work them into the abstract.
Hmm. 900 word limit so it's not going to give much detail - but hopefully just enough to get the right crowd there for the discussion!
Jonathan
Quoted 39 lines
1.c. Beyond demos and toys. Is IIO suitable for real-world applications?
Quoted 24 lines
2. High performance usecases - (Lars leading this one if he is willing) DMA buffers and moving that infrastructure forward. There is a lot of out of kernel code around this currently, it would be nice to drag it in once we are sure on how it should work long term!
3. Missing in kernel consumer infrastructure. We never implemented consumer interfaces for events. I assume this may be because no one cares, but it does sometimes feel like we are working around that in some of the use cases rather than just fixing it.
4. The Front end / back end split. This is most interesting for SoC ADCs where we currently put out an IIO interface to userspace that no one cares about (sometimes). The plan was always to make that optional. Would be interesting to explore pushing this forward. This includes things like the little used available callbacks.
5. General performance questions - can we narrow the gap with the dodgy userspace hacks?
N. General process discussion - Is the current maintainer / review process
quick enough that it isn't causing anyone too much pain? What can we do better? I'm always happy to get some feedback on this btw.Quoted 7 lines
So if at all possible, what I'm looking for is additional (of better) ideas to put down as somewhat of a placeholder to show we have lots to talk about.
If not I'll throw the above in with some editing.
Jonathan
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Quoted 55 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:07:40 +0100 Jonathan Cameron…
Quoted 52 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:16:35 +0200 Lars-Peter Clausen <[email protected]> wrote:
Quoted 42 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Quoted 27 lines · On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 10:48:01 +0300 Daniel Baluta <[email protected]>…
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
Quoted 7 lines
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.Cool - so it sounds like there is enough interest (given the very short notice!) to apply for a BoF. The tricky bit is I need to put together an abstract by later today.
Quoted 6 lines
So off the top of my head topics that come to mind are:
1. Userspace ABI pain points - the recent extensive discussions around the energy meters have certainly shown there are some nasty corners. The currently open question about floating point support is also interesting (though we may well have come to a conclusion about that long before October).
Some things about ABI
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 3 lines
1.a. Is cross device ABI achievable or are we moving towards IIO being a simple userspace and kernelspace bridge with each driver having its own ABI? Is IIO the new
drivers/misc?Good points. I'll work them into the abstract.
Hmm. 900 word limit so it's not going to give much detail - but hopefully just enough to get the right crowd there for the discussion!
In the interests of a pleasant Sunday evening, submitted. I've put a proviso that we'll probably update the topics depending on what happens in the next few months.
Thanks all and please keep the conversation going on the mailing list. If it doesn't happen at ELCE we can either do something informal or look at other venues in the near future. Going through the exercise has made if clear that as a community there are useful things to talk about!
Anyhow, hope to see some of you in Edinburgh (it's really nice by the way if anyone was wavering - I was there on holiday last month for a few days!)
Jonathan
Quoted 47 lines
Jonathan
Quoted 32 lines
1.c. Beyond demos and toys. Is IIO suitable for real-world applications?
Quoted 29 lines
2. High performance usecases - (Lars leading this one if he is willing) DMA buffers and moving that infrastructure forward. There is a lot of out of kernel code around this currently, it would be nice to drag it in once we are sure on how it should work long term!
3. Missing in kernel consumer infrastructure. We never implemented consumer interfaces for events. I assume this may be because no one cares, but it does sometimes feel like we are working around that in some of the use cases rather than just fixing it.
4. The Front end / back end split. This is most interesting for SoC ADCs where we currently put out an IIO interface to userspace that no one cares about (sometimes). The plan was always to make that optional. Would be interesting to explore pushing this forward. This includes things like the little used available callbacks.
5. General performance questions - can we narrow the gap with the dodgy userspace hacks?
N. General process discussion - Is the current maintainer / review process
quick enough that it isn't causing anyone too much pain? What can we do better? I'm always happy to get some feedback on this btw.So if at all possible, what I'm looking for is additional (of better) ideas to put down as somewhat of a placeholder to show we have lots to talk about.
If not I'll throw the above in with some editing.
Quoted 7 lines
Quoted 2 lines
Jonathan
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To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-iio" in the body of a message to [email protected]
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Hi all,
So a mixed bag for ELCE. The straight forward talk on lessons learned etc
for IIO was accepted, but the BoF to discuss future directions was not.
Anyhow, I'll be at the conference as will at least a few others and I am sure we can find a venue for an 'unofficial' BoF. I'll send an email nearer to the time so we can try an find a slot in which maximum people can meet up.
If anyone want to catch up separately, just let me know. I should be able to get up earlier on Sunday or delay returning on the Thursday if it is useful (the rare advantages of being able to catch a frequent train to a conference :))
Looking forward to catching up with those I've met before and meeting those I haven't!
Jonathan
Quoted 133 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:27:33 +0100 Jonathan Cameron…
Quoted 55 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 18:07:40 +0100 Jonathan Cameron…
Quoted 52 lines · On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:16:35 +0200 Lars-Peter Clausen <[email protected]> wrote:
Quoted 42 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Quoted 27 lines · On Fri, 29 Jun 2018 10:48:01 +0300 Daniel Baluta <[email protected]>…
Quoted 17 lines · Lars-Peter Clausen
Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 2 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be at ELCE and I'm very interested in sitting down and having a longer discussion about the state of the framework, potential future developments, their requirements and how to get there.
I think a BoF would be good as a discussion starter and then maybe follow up on that with the people who are interested and have a more focused discussion.
Quoted 7 lines
I'll be there. Although, I'm mainly involved now with IIO via Outreachy/GSoC I think it is a good idea to have the meeting in the form of a BoF.
CC-ing Eugen, I noticed he has done a lot of work recently in the IIO area.
thanks,
Daniel.Cool - so it sounds like there is enough interest (given the very short notice!) to apply for a BoF. The tricky bit is I need to put together an abstract by later today.
Quoted 6 lines
So off the top of my head topics that come to mind are:
1. Userspace ABI pain points - the recent extensive discussions around the energy meters have certainly shown there are some nasty corners. The currently open question about floating point support is also interesting (though we may well have come to a conclusion about that long before October).
Some things about ABI
Quoted 8 lines
Quoted 3 lines
1.a. Is cross device ABI achievable or are we moving towards IIO being a simple userspace and kernelspace bridge with each driver having its own ABI? Is IIO the new
drivers/misc?Good points. I'll work them into the abstract.
Hmm. 900 word limit so it's not going to give much detail - but hopefully just enough to get the right crowd there for the discussion!
In the interests of a pleasant Sunday evening, submitted. I've put a proviso that we'll probably update the topics depending on what happens in the next few months.
Thanks all and please keep the conversation going on the mailing list. If it doesn't happen at ELCE we can either do something informal or look at other venues in the near future. Going through the exercise has made if clear that as a community there are useful things to talk about!
Anyhow, hope to see some of you in Edinburgh (it's really nice by the way if anyone was wavering - I was there on holiday last month for a few days!)
Jonathan
Quoted 43 lines
Jonathan
Quoted 32 lines
1.c. Beyond demos and toys. Is IIO suitable for real-world applications?
Quoted 29 lines
2. High performance usecases - (Lars leading this one if he is willing) DMA buffers and moving that infrastructure forward. There is a lot of out of kernel code around this currently, it would be nice to drag it in once we are sure on how it should work long term!
3. Missing in kernel consumer infrastructure. We never implemented consumer interfaces for events. I assume this may be because no one cares, but it does sometimes feel like we are working around that in some of the use cases rather than just fixing it.
4. The Front end / back end split. This is most interesting for SoC ADCs where we currently put out an IIO interface to userspace that no one cares about (sometimes). The plan was always to make that optional. Would be interesting to explore pushing this forward. This includes things like the little used available callbacks.
5. General performance questions - can we narrow the gap with the dodgy userspace hacks?
N. General process discussion - Is the current maintainer / review process
quick enough that it isn't causing anyone too much pain? What can we do better? I'm always happy to get some feedback on this btw.So if at all possible, what I'm looking for is additional (of better) ideas to put down as somewhat of a placeholder to show we have lots to talk about.
If not I'll throw the above in with some editing.
Quoted 7 lines
Quoted 2 lines
Jonathan
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More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.htmlQuoted 4 lines
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Quoted 16 lines · Jonathan Cameron
Hi All,
I know at least a few IIO developers are likely to be at the Embedded Linux
Conference Europe in a few months time. Hence this email is exploring the
possibility of us doing something we have never done for IIO before and have
a formal meet up. I would propose the topics to discuss would be loosely
around future directions for IIO development. This might consist of actual proposals or simply discussion of pain points.I'm not sure how long a session would be sensible, but one possibility is to propose it as a BoF as that fits in their standard schedule without needing any additional organization - I think by default that only gives us an hour or so. However, the deadline to propose one of those is this Sunday so things are little tight. We don't need a fully planned schedule but it would be good to have made a start. If we decide to do this I'll write an abstract and submit it.
Quoted 3 lines
So I'm looking for topics and some idea of who is going to be there or might be persuaded to make the trip!
I'll be there as well! Even though I'm not as involved as I used to be I'd like to sit down
and talk more about the future of iio in a BoF.
Quoted 20 lines
Chances are we won't actually 'finish' any non trivial discussions, but it is a lot easier to make progress on topics that you've at least outlined in person.
Please forward to anyone who may be interested and might not see it on the list before Sunday. Obviously Sunday isn't a cut off for discussion, it's just when I have hope to be able to draw together a proposal!
Jonathan
p.s. I'm planning to put a normal talk session proposal in as well. It'll trawl through a bit of the history of IIO (it's 10 years old this year!), lessons learned etc. Not a tutorial, but an analysis of some more general useful stuff with just enough description of IIO to let the uninitiated know what we are talking about! I'll also touch on encouraging new contributors etc. No idea if the committee will like that approach, so who knows ;)
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