Dual athlon XP 1800 problems
Not sure if this is an apposite list, but found this thread .... apologise in advance.
I just built a similar dual AMD machine tonight and it also has issues....... never used any AMD stuff before so venturing into new turf.
Tyan S2460 - motherboard sticker says "C", BIOS rev 1.03
2 x Athlon MP 2000+ (1666 MHz) - retail packaged, AMD clip-on heatsinks and fans 1Gb PC2100 ECC registered memory (2 x 512Mb DIMMs, Kingston branded)
Red Hat 7.2 but downloaded and built 2.4.19, configured for SMP, Athlon target Single IDE drives, no RAID or stuff like that
Tekram DC390 (8 bit SCSI)
3Com Cyclone 3C905
D-Link DE-590TX (??) - uses ne2k-pci driver, has worked since early 2.0.x and probably before ATI Rage 3D Pro (AGP 2x)
Big Antec case with a ton of fans :-)
1. When I first put it together, it would consistenly run OK for a period of 4-5 minutes, quite precisely - no less than 4, no more than 5 and then just lock up HARD - no Ctrl-Alt-Del, no kernel panics, nothing. Once or twice it seemed like it stuttered - as if the load was like 10.00 or higher, the keystroke echo would take 2-3 seconds.
2. First try - I pulled the Tekram (it's ancient and has bootable BIOS) - no difference
3. Tried some BIOS settings (e.g. SMP 1.1 mode) - it DOES NOT like this; any BIOS changes AT ALL (even seemingly harmless ones like Num Lock) appear to mess it up totally, and LILO hangs at "LI" when trying to start. Restored factory defaults.
4. Then I noticed that the CPU1 heatsink was quite warm (maybe 70C feeling around the thick bit of the aluminium) whereas CPU0 heatsink is just above room temp.
5. Checking the Winbond monitoring in the BIOS** menu, it comes up showing both CPU's at 77C, then as you hit keys it takes proper readings, and claims both CPUs within 1-2 degrees of each other (??). It seems accurate on fan speeds though. Both fans running pretty fast, 5500-6200 RPM.
6. Pulled CPU1, messed around some - same behaviour, lock ups after 4-5 mins
7. Brought it up to single user mode console, to see if it was video card etc. - did some testing of just letting it mostly idle (while true - uptime - sleep 1 - etc.) and locked up 1-2 more times.
8. Rebooted again, now it's up and running and appears stable (still 1 CPU), so I took it up to full init 5 and it stayed up (and so I'm writing this email :-) Once or twice seemed to stall again for 1-2 seconds (interrupt storm ???) but recovered.
Anyone have suggestions? I'm thinking to leave it running and see if it stays up. Smells of a hardware issue, but also the BIOS seems a bit funny (there is a message in the Help which says "this setting for debug only - remove for production" !!)
Other observation, possibly unrelated: the unpacking of the kernel seems very slow for an otherwise pretty quick machine - the dots when it says "Loading xxx..." tick at about 1 per second, much like a laptop with PC-66 memory, compared with 4-5 per second for the Pentium III 800/PC-133 motherboard I just hauled out.
** The temperature sensor driver stuff didn't seem to come with the kernel ??
Don't know about the kernel issues your experiencing but I have that board and the BIOS does seem a bit flaky - I can confirm however that the temperature monitoring as you noticed doesn't give sane readings until you hit update for the first time.
I have Dual Athlon MP 1.2Ghz, 768MB crucial ECC RAM and kernel 2.4.19 optimized for athlonmp using gentoo patches and its solid as a rock. The only problems I've had were full lock-ups when compiling but I traced that to a faulty dimm module.
Cheers
ali
Quoted 8 lines
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:linux-kernel- [email protected]] On Behalf Of David Crooke
Sent: 15 November 2002 10:32
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Dual athlon XP 1800 problems
Quoted 5 lines
Not sure if this is an apposite list, but found this thread .... apologise in advance.
I just built a similar dual AMD machine tonight and it also has issues....... never used any AMD stuff before so venturing into new
turf.
Quoted 3 lines
Tyan S2460 - motherboard sticker says "C", BIOS rev 1.03 2 x Athlon MP 2000+ (1666 MHz) - retail packaged, AMD clip-on
heatsinks
Quoted 3 lines
and fans
1Gb PC2100 ECC registered memory (2 x 512Mb DIMMs, Kingston branded) Red Hat 7.2 but downloaded and built 2.4.19, configured for SMP,
Athlon
Quoted 8 lines
target
Single IDE drives, no RAID or stuff like that
Tekram DC390 (8 bit SCSI)
3Com Cyclone 3C905
D-Link DE-590TX (??) - uses ne2k-pci driver, has worked since early 2.0.x and probably before
ATI Rage 3D Pro (AGP 2x)
Quoted 4 lines
Big Antec case with a ton of fans :-)
1. When I first put it together, it would consistenly run OK for a period of 4-5 minutes, quite precisely - no less than 4, no more than
5
Quoted 1 line
and then just lock up HARD - no Ctrl-Alt-Del, no kernel panics,
nothing.
Quoted 4 lines
Once or twice it seemed like it stuttered - as if the load was like 10.00 or higher, the keystroke echo would take 2-3 seconds.
2. First try - I pulled the Tekram (it's ancient and has bootable
BIOS)
Quoted 3 lines
- no difference
3. Tried some BIOS settings (e.g. SMP 1.1 mode) - it DOES NOT like
this;
Quoted 6 lines
any BIOS changes AT ALL (even seemingly harmless ones like Num Lock) appear to mess it up totally, and LILO hangs at "LI" when trying to start. Restored factory defaults.
4. Then I noticed that the CPU1 heatsink was quite warm (maybe 70C feeling around the thick bit of the aluminium) whereas CPU0 heatsink
is
Quoted 5 lines
just above room temp.
5. Checking the Winbond monitoring in the BIOS** menu, it comes up showing both CPU's at 77C, then as you hit keys it takes proper readings, and claims both CPUs within 1-2 degrees of each other (??).
It
Quoted 4 lines
seems accurate on fan speeds though. Both fans running pretty fast, 5500-6200 RPM.
6. Pulled CPU1, messed around some - same behaviour, lock ups after
4-5
Quoted 4 lines
mins
7. Brought it up to single user mode console, to see if it was video card etc. - did some testing of just letting it mostly idle (while
true
Quoted 8 lines
- uptime - sleep 1 - etc.) and locked up 1-2 more times.
8. Rebooted again, now it's up and running and appears stable (still 1 CPU), so I took it up to full init 5 and it stayed up (and so I'm writing this email :-) Once or twice seemed to stall again for 1-2 seconds (interrupt storm ???) but recovered.
Anyone have suggestions? I'm thinking to leave it running and see if
it
Quoted 2 lines
stays up. Smells of a hardware issue, but also the BIOS seems a bit funny (there is a message in the Help which says "this setting for
debug
Quoted 3 lines
only - remove for production" !!)
Other observation, possibly unrelated: the unpacking of the kernel
seems
Quoted 1 line
very slow for an otherwise pretty quick machine - the dots when it
says
Quoted 21 lines
"Loading xxx..." tick at about 1 per second, much like a laptop with PC-66 memory, compared with 4-5 per second for the Pentium III 800/PC-133 motherboard I just hauled out.
** The temperature sensor driver stuff didn't seem to come with the kernel ??
Quoted 2 lines
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To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe
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Quoted 3 lines
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Quoted 3 lines · David Crooke
1. When I first put it together, it would consistenly run OK for a period of 4-5 minutes, quite precisely - no less than 4, no more than 5 and then just lock up HARD - no Ctrl-Alt-Del, no kernel panics, nothing.
Turn off ACPI and APM in the bios as a starter.
Quoted 4 lines
3. Tried some BIOS settings (e.g. SMP 1.1 mode) - it DOES NOT like this; any BIOS changes AT ALL (even seemingly harmless ones like Num Lock) appear to mess it up totally, and LILO hangs at "LI" when trying to start. Restored factory defaults.
Make sure you have a current BIOS on dual athlon boxes, the earlier bioses were not terribly good on the whole. Make sure you have a PS/2 mouse in the mouse port even if you aren;t going to use it
Quoted 3 lines · Alan Cox
Make sure you have a current BIOS on dual athlon boxes, the earlier bioses were not terribly good on the whole. Make sure you have a PS/2 mouse in the mouse port even if you aren;t going to use it
Unless he's lucky with steppings, it's also possible he's being bitten by running XP's instead of MPs.
Dave
Signature · 2 lines
| Dave Jones. http://www.codemonkey.org.uk | SuSE Labs
Quoted 7 lines · Dave Jones
Quoted 3 lines · Alan Cox
Make sure you have a current BIOS on dual athlon boxes, the earlier bioses were not terribly good on the whole. Make sure you have a PS/2 mouse in the mouse port even if you aren;t going to use it
Unless he's lucky with steppings, it's also possible he's being bitten by running XP's instead of MPs.
BTW, since I've upgraded my Asus bios, my 2 XP1800 are reported as MP1800. There's absolutely no way for me to tell that they're in fact XPs, except from dismounting the cooling fans and read the chips. Although they're quite stable even at very high temperatures (I could compile a complete kernel with fans unplugged, but the case was as hot as a pizza oven), I know that there are people out there with unstable dual XP setups and I frankly don't know how they could tell that they're XP if their reseller sold them as MPs and installed the fan himself.
Cheers,
Willy
Quoted 6 lines
1. When I first put it together, it would consistenly run OK for a period of 4-5 minutes, quite precisely - no less than 4, no more than 5 and then just lock up HARD - no Ctrl-Alt-Del, no kernel panics, nothing. Once or twice it seemed like it stuttered - as if the load was like 10.00 or higher, the keystroke echo would take 2-3 seconds.
Quoted 7 lines
2. First try - I pulled the Tekram (it's ancient and has bootable BIOS)
- no difference3. Tried some BIOS settings (e.g. SMP 1.1 mode) - it DOES NOT like this; any BIOS changes AT ALL (even seemingly harmless ones like Num Lock) appear to mess it up totally, and LILO hangs at "LI" when trying to start. Restored factory defaults.
I have a S2460 with dual 1800MPs using BIOS rev 1.04. I had very similar problems (random hangs, sometimes after 2 minutes, sometimes after 36 hours). Here's what I did to solve them:
1) Turn off power management in the BIOS. I still have power management enabled in linux and all is fine.
2) (this is the most important one) Make sure you have a minimum of a 500 watt power supply. Each CPU alone is rated for 66 watts of consumption.
3) I still get random hangs at boot (usually after rebooting linux) and I believe this is due to some ACPI problem. A hard reboot (turn the power supply off and on) fixes it for me.
4) There are a couple bugs with the 760MP chipset and APICs. To see if they're affecting you, add "mem=nopentium noapic" to your kernel parameters (I can run fine without them).
Quoted 9 lines
4. Then I noticed that the CPU1 heatsink was quite warm (maybe 70C feeling around the thick bit of the aluminium) whereas CPU0 heatsink is just above room temp.
5. Checking the Winbond monitoring in the BIOS** menu, it comes up showing both CPU's at 77C, then as you hit keys it takes proper readings, and claims both CPUs within 1-2 degrees of each other (??). It seems accurate on fan speeds though. Both fans running pretty fast, 5500-6200 RPM.
My BIOS reports the right temps but lm_sensors didn't. I too was getting temps in the 75C+ range. To fix lm_sensors, do the following:
echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor1 echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor2 echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor3
Quoted 3 lines
7. Brought it up to single user mode console, to see if it was video card etc. - did some testing of just letting it mostly idle (while true
- uptime - sleep 1 - etc.) and locked up 1-2 more times.
I thought it was my video card too... so I went out and spent $90 on a new one only to find it does the same thing.
Quoted 4 lines
8. Rebooted again, now it's up and running and appears stable (still 1 CPU), so I took it up to full init 5 and it stayed up (and so I'm writing this email :-) Once or twice seemed to stall again for 1-2 seconds (interrupt storm ???) but recovered.
I notice this sometimes too... I chalk it up to some SMP locking somewhere. Currently up 6 days, 3:53 with the maximum around 40 days (rebooted to upgrade kernel).
Quoted 5 lines
Other observation, possibly unrelated: the unpacking of the kernel seems very slow for an otherwise pretty quick machine - the dots when it says "Loading xxx..." tick at about 1 per second, much like a laptop with PC-66 memory, compared with 4-5 per second for the Pentium III 800/PC-133 motherboard I just hauled out.
When mine hasn't reset right (the aforementioned ACPI lockup), mine does this. It was especially prevalent before I upgraded my power supply from 400 to 550 watts
Quoted 2 lines
** The temperature sensor driver stuff didn't seem to come with the kernel ??
pick up the lm_sensors package
Signature · 3 lines
Ken Witherow <phantoml AT rochester.rr.com>
ICQ: 21840670 AIM: phantomlordken
http://www.krwtech.com/kenQuoted 9 lines · Willy Tarreau
Quoted 7 lines · Dave Jones
Quoted 3 lines · Alan Cox
Make sure you have a current BIOS on dual athlon boxes, the earlier bioses were not terribly good on the whole. Make sure you have a PS/2 mouse in the mouse port even if you aren;t going to use it
Unless he's lucky with steppings, it's also possible he's being bitten by running XP's instead of MPs.
Quoted 8 lines
BTW, since I've upgraded my Asus bios, my 2 XP1800 are reported as MP1800. There's absolutely no way for me to tell that they're in fact XPs, except from dismounting the cooling fans and read the chips. Although they're quite stable even at very high temperatures (I could compile a complete kernel with fans unplugged, but the case was as hot as a pizza oven), I know that there are people out there with unstable dual XP setups and I frankly don't know how they could tell that they're XP if their reseller sold them as MPs and installed the fan himself.
I have the ASUS A7M266-D board with 2 XP1800 as well with the same issue (though it reported them as MP with the early and the later BIOS).
The deal here was that the early steppings of the XP processors, through about the 1800 series, which didn't have the "MP disable" bridge cut. When they released the 1900's and higher, this was changed, but you can still find XP 1800's and lower which just appear as MP processors.
However, the machine runs rock stable with the stock i686 patch kernel from RedHat on a 350W power supply (I even tweaked the voltages down quite a bit to get the processors to run cooler, works great).
--
Erich Stefan Boleyn <[email protected]> http://www.uruk.org/
"Reality is truly stranger than fiction; Probably why fiction is so popular"
i had similar issues on my old 2460 board.
i found out that a huge power supply doesn't cut it, you need a QUALITY power supply of ~400watts( more specifically the 5 volt bus).
i also found out the hard way that i believe tyan didn't design that board properly because the 5 volt part of the connectors were burned up on the PS and MB.
i've since replaced with a s2466n-4m and am very happy.
i'd check your power supply connector before it burns up yours too...
-steve
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]On Behalf Of Ken Witherow
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2002 11:26 AM
To: David Crooke
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Dual athlon XP 1800 problems
Quoted 6 lines
1. When I first put it together, it would consistenly run OK for a period of 4-5 minutes, quite precisely - no less than 4, no more than 5 and then just lock up HARD - no Ctrl-Alt-Del, no kernel panics, nothing. Once or twice it seemed like it stuttered - as if the load was like 10.00 or higher, the keystroke echo would take 2-3 seconds.
Quoted 7 lines
2. First try - I pulled the Tekram (it's ancient and has bootable BIOS)
- no difference3. Tried some BIOS settings (e.g. SMP 1.1 mode) - it DOES NOT like this; any BIOS changes AT ALL (even seemingly harmless ones like Num Lock) appear to mess it up totally, and LILO hangs at "LI" when trying to start. Restored factory defaults.
I have a S2460 with dual 1800MPs using BIOS rev 1.04. I had very similar problems (random hangs, sometimes after 2 minutes, sometimes after 36 hours). Here's what I did to solve them:
1) Turn off power management in the BIOS. I still have power management enabled in linux and all is fine.
2) (this is the most important one) Make sure you have a minimum of a 500 watt power supply. Each CPU alone is rated for 66 watts of consumption.
3) I still get random hangs at boot (usually after rebooting linux) and I believe this is due to some ACPI problem. A hard reboot (turn the power supply off and on) fixes it for me.
4) There are a couple bugs with the 760MP chipset and APICs. To see if they're affecting you, add "mem=nopentium noapic" to your kernel parameters (I can run fine without them).
Quoted 9 lines
4. Then I noticed that the CPU1 heatsink was quite warm (maybe 70C feeling around the thick bit of the aluminium) whereas CPU0 heatsink is just above room temp.
5. Checking the Winbond monitoring in the BIOS** menu, it comes up showing both CPU's at 77C, then as you hit keys it takes proper readings, and claims both CPUs within 1-2 degrees of each other (??). It seems accurate on fan speeds though. Both fans running pretty fast, 5500-6200 RPM.
My BIOS reports the right temps but lm_sensors didn't. I too was getting temps in the 75C+ range. To fix lm_sensors, do the following:
echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor1 echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor2 echo "2" > /proc/sys/dev/sensors/w83782d-i2c-0-2d/sensor3
Quoted 3 lines
7. Brought it up to single user mode console, to see if it was video card etc. - did some testing of just letting it mostly idle (while true
- uptime - sleep 1 - etc.) and locked up 1-2 more times.
I thought it was my video card too... so I went out and spent $90 on a new one only to find it does the same thing.
Quoted 4 lines
8. Rebooted again, now it's up and running and appears stable (still 1 CPU), so I took it up to full init 5 and it stayed up (and so I'm writing this email :-) Once or twice seemed to stall again for 1-2 seconds (interrupt storm ???) but recovered.
I notice this sometimes too... I chalk it up to some SMP locking somewhere. Currently up 6 days, 3:53 with the maximum around 40 days (rebooted to upgrade kernel).
Quoted 5 lines
Other observation, possibly unrelated: the unpacking of the kernel seems very slow for an otherwise pretty quick machine - the dots when it says "Loading xxx..." tick at about 1 per second, much like a laptop with PC-66 memory, compared with 4-5 per second for the Pentium III 800/PC-133 motherboard I just hauled out.
When mine hasn't reset right (the aforementioned ACPI lockup), mine does this. It was especially prevalent before I upgraded my power supply from 400 to 550 watts
Quoted 2 lines
** The temperature sensor driver stuff didn't seem to come with the kernel ??
pick up the lm_sensors package
--
Ken Witherow <phantoml AT rochester.rr.com>
ICQ: 21840670 AIM: phantomlordken
http://www.krwtech.com/ken
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Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Quoted 5 lines · steve roemen
i had similar issues on my old 2460 board.
i found out that a huge power supply doesn't cut it, you need a QUALITY power supply of ~400watts( more specifically the 5 volt bus).
Quoted 7 lines
i also found out the hard way that i believe tyan didn't design that board properly because the 5 volt part of the connectors were burned up on the PS and MB.
i've since replaced with a s2466n-4m and am very happy.
i'd check your power supply connector before it burns up yours too...
PSU connector is fine... and I definitely need the extra juice since I'm running quite a bit of power hungry hardware in this box (5 SCSI drives, a GF4, etc). Both power supplies are pretty good Antecs. It does bother me that they didn't use the AUX connector for the extra 5V power though
Signature · 3 lines
Ken Witherow <phantoml AT rochester.rr.com>
ICQ: 21840670 AIM: phantomlordken
http://www.krwtech.com/kenI'm powering two 1.2Ghz MPs with this board from a 300watt power supply and its rock solid so unless you've got a lot of power hungry devices (scsi harddrives I guess) then you should get away with a lot less than 500W.
Quoted 2 lines
When mine hasn't reset right (the aforementioned ACPI lockup), mine
does
Quoted 1 line
this. It was especially prevalent before I upgraded my power supply
from
Quoted 2 lines
400 to 550 watts
Quoted 3 lines · Ken Witherow
4) There are a couple bugs with the 760MP chipset and APICs. To see if they're affecting you, add "mem=nopentium noapic" to your kernel parameters (I can run fine without them).
mem=nopentium isnt related to any AMD760MP/MPX stuff. SOme boxes seem to need noapic, although a PS/2 mouse may cure that